chances of bad news at 20 week scan mumsnet chances of bad news at 20 week scan mumsnet

Another sick joke. The rarest scenario is that the baby is severely ill and choices will need to be made. SO much upset and needless angst has been caused by 'soft markers' found at scans. A company limited by guarantee registered in England and Wales company number 3266897. I was willing the results to be normal. The gel makes sure there is good contact between the probe and your skin. So it was just, we were coming up to the 20-week scan and I was just getting more relaxed, just actually starting to look at maybe baby catalogues or, you know, going down the baby aisle at the shops, which I'd always avoided. . All the hopes, dreams, and plans we made with our little bumps has been taken away from us. I was sent home with a leaflet, strong painkillers and two types of antibiotics. The same anxious wait for a little, pathetic cry. When I think about how long it took them to deliberate ultimately, maybe not, but it just felt like a bit of a fast food situation, didn't it? And I couldn't escape the feeling that I was being selfish. Immediately I knew what decision we should take. And, so they sent me home at that stage because they said the specialist wasn't available till the following day, which was awful. If you think you may have a medical emergency, call your doctor, midwife or hospital immediately. It will take only 2 minutes to fill in. The first words I said were: "If there's anything wrong then it's my fault", I had been working 70, nearly 80 hours the previous weeks and pushed myself hard. And I'd been on the internet looking up all sorts of things and everything was so negative, it was very depressing, because I thought, 'Well, maybe they've made a mistake, or maybe it's something they can fix, I don't know'. We bought a two tests that evening (quite lucky as I messed the first one up!). It was another consultant, who said, "I'm afraid I have some bad news - your baby has Down's syndrome." But everything seemed fine and we'd been sitting waiting to see the consultant, and I'd had an examination on the bed. That he - I think I was 21 weeks and 3 days, and he was coming up at 19 weeks and 4 days, or something like that. When I told him what had happened, he refused to believe anything was wrong and said he'd sort it out when he came home. I thought I was going to burst into tears. Thankfully I was met by an amazing sonographer, she was compassionate and understanding. We'd just spent some time away on a, on a summer holiday and come back expecting to have this scan and be told, 'All fine. It was, 'Oh we'll come back to that'. Baby loss support I returned to be told they wanted to scan me again, another internal to see exactly what was happening. Is it the same scan or is it the same equipment? We went, I went in to the scanning room and they're quite bland facially anyway, whether everything's fine or not they just look at the screen to start off with and do measurements but I very quickly realised that the woman's demeanour wasn't, even for a bland face, was concerning. I felt empty, scared, guilty and incredibly heartbroken. It seemed inconceivable that we would not be having a baby in May. blood tests, CVS) were clear - and as one woman put it, 'after the triple test* (Down's syndrome screening) you stop thinking anything can go wrong'. So obviously quite relaxed. These were said to be soft markers fo a range of trisomies, 2 of which were incompatible with life. And at that point I don't think we, I don't think we realised that there might have to be a decision, because we'd talked about it with, with Down's and the other possible problems, but at this point it was, well okay what can be done to fix the problem - because yes the heart's not developing properly but there must be something we can do. This scan takes place between 18 weeks and 20 weeks 6 days of pregnancy and is commonly called the 20-week scan. She describes having to make a . We also use cookies set by other sites to help us deliver content from their services. A black and white picture of your baby will then be seen on the ultrasound screen. There, I would give birth. I didn't sleep that night I don't think. Not marginalised into being a victim. All the time, the baby was kicking and I felt like a murderer waiting to strike her victim. The hormone levels had dropped, but they wanted to scan me again. I can feel my child kick, it responds when he shouts at football - I mean literally, this baby used to dance around whenever he'd like scream at a goal - and there cannot be anything wrong with this child because it's part of us already. There was complete silence during the scan. We spent the next few weeks in a happy bubble. It seemed a very arbitrary system, and so you quite often sat outside in the waiting room for a couple of hours before you actually got to see the consultant, which was, seemed you know, I kind of remember thinking before we went in to see him on the particular day when we found out there was a problem, 'Why are we sitting here? I would be put to sleep, and when I woke up I wouldn't be pregnant any more. We would terminate the pregnancy. When I see a child with Down's syndrome, I have a tremendous need to explain myself and apologise a million times over. Please note that the opinions expressed by users in Tommys Book of #misCOURAGE are solely those of the user, who is unlikely to have had medical training. I couldn't bring myself to push. 20 week scans look for 11 different anomalies as a rule, however, indicators (markers) are not terribly reliable and in all the literature I found, the targets set for stonographers look like they only pick up around 50% or less of these variants. And the first few things they said it didn't sound as thing, as though things were terribly wrong. It doesn't remove the guilt, but I don't know what else to do. You do not have to have the scan. And that was a terrible moment to be sort of hanging on, waiting. He then told us what the prognosis would mean for the child. So we decided to book an early 10 week private scan. So carried on with the plans, and, you know, planning for the, another baby to come along and then we went for a 20- week scan which is obviously the big one and very exciting, seeing all the arms and legs and once again everything was going fine, 'Look here's the baby, here's the length of baby'. Surely he couldn't have missed anything else that is so serious x. He looked fine. Sometimes doctors will wait to give the baby more time to develop and carry out repeat scans - this had confused several parents we talked to who had gone for repeat scans not knowing that the baby might have a problem. I feel empty and incomplete. And also what the prognosis would mean for our two year old: now a very happy child, he would have a completely different childhood with such an ill sibling. Maybe. We were told to go to the hospital immediately. . We've got the same battle scars. Limitations of the 18-20 week scan And at that, I let out a scream I think. And I said, I was still laughing, and I thought he was joking with me, and he said now I sort of could tell from his face that by that point he wasn't really joking anymore. Just wonder whether anyone had ever been told? You have accepted additional cookies. Having the scan does not hurt but the sonographer may need to apply slight pressure to get the best views of your baby. We both thought we would like some good to come out of this horrible experience, so wanted to talk to somebody about the possibility of using the body for research purposes. And I knew there was no way out. But the consultant had found more spots on the heart and the measurements were the same. Forcing my hand to my mouth to take the tablet was probably the hardest thing I have ever done. But he was not sure. The following is a quote from their report: If the scan reveals either a suspected or confirmed abnormality, the woman should be informed by the sonographer at the time of the scan. We talked all night and thanked God for crap television. The same anticipation. My partner watched the baby come out, and for a split second I saw a look of joy on his face. The scan can provide information that may mean you have to make further, important decisions. An hour passed and I started to panic. For once in my life, I had been organised. And they, sort of two of them were looking at the scan machine and then they sort of switched everything off and said, 'Oh, I think we have, might have a problem'. Within two days I was waiting in my local EPU unit for further tests. Mm-hm. Previous scans in this pregnancy and with my first child had been fun - a chance to see the baby wriggling around and perhaps find out its sex. How common is it for 2nd baby to come early..? Any delay in receiving more information about the abnormality and its implications will be distressing for women and this should be acknowledged. I know it sounds odd that you want to hear that it's wrong, but you, you know it's wrong, and you, you want to be reassured either that it's okay or is there something seriously wrong. I tried to show him the notes and the photos. The only thing you're thinking now is the birth, and what if something goes wrong in the birth? I didn't want to go through anymore scans. We must have had one before that as well, we must have had one before that, but it came back quite normal. Wed like to set additional cookies to understand how you use GOV.UK, remember your settings and improve government services. So once again we were right back down, really no, really not knowing what to expect. If necessary, you will be referred to a specialist, possibly in another hospital. Have I misunderstood what's going on?' It was horrible. Mumsnet carries some affiliate marketing links, so if you buy something through our posts, we may get a small share of the sale (more details here). It felt as if we'd gone underground, that we were part of the criminal fraternity. He started to scan me with a cold expression, then told me, "it didn't look good" and that "my womb looked raggedy". The sonographer will be able to tell you the results of the scan at the time. Later, I did see and hold our baby. My partner was away working and was waiting to hear whether he was having a son or daughter. The scan yet again confirmed things were not good, however the sac had grown. I thought surely everything is ok, as they couldn't detect twins the week before. Others, including those who had been given leaflets to read about the scan beforehand as well as some who were health professionals, said that they had been nave about the 20-week scan. The blood test confirmed it was twins. And I can just remember flashing a look at you as if to say, 'Have I made a mistake here somewhere? And having read, since read my information on Edwards' syndrome, a good 85 per cent have problems with the heart. Sometimes specialist scans such as 3D scans, or MRI scans, are used to examine the baby in greater detail. Laura miscarried her twin babies in February. To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account. I had to stop myself from yanking out the needle. I had to be rescanned latter. It felt like a lifetime to reach our 12-week-scan. See you in -. For five months my body had known there was something wrong, yet I had felt fantastic. Yeah, yeah. I give pregnant women dirty looks. As though I went power mad for a week, killing my innocent unborn child, and now I am tainted for ever. Christmas came and went in a blur of emotion, it felt so wrong to be celebrating when we were in such turmoil. I wasn't unduly worried at all. x. I wanted to be a passive patient while the doctor did what he had to do. Again the legs were quite twisted, they said that the baby's sternum was very short - things weren't in proportion you know - the head was quite large, the neck was very thick, there wasn't really like a neck as such it was just things were kind of - there were lots of things that obviously the consultant could see that we weren't aware of. unfortunately the 20 week anomaly scan can pick up serious issues, hearing heart beats at midwife appointment doesn't let us know what's going on inside the body in detail. Many described how sonographers and doctors were very restrained and didn't speak at all until they had analysed all the baby's details. I couldn't have the added responsibility for changing his mind. This one cannot show you anything, that's what's inside your mind. And then I can't remember an awful lot more about that scan apart from that feeling of searching of how to react in an unknown situation - your brain's kind of trying to work out what to say, what to do, but I had no idea what to say or what to do and I think my first thought was, does that mean our first daughter's okay? (See 'Resources'). My son's congenital heart defect was detected at the 20 week scan and he had 2 other markers, no . At that point, I got very not upset but quite sort of strongly severe sort of with the people at the hospital saying, 'Look, you know, that's 24 hours, possibly a 48 hours' wait - that's not something that's tenable. My baby might have Down's syndrome. But they didn't. And it turned out the baby's heart wasn't forming properly, the chambers weren't forming properly. I then had to wait in the room along with many other patients for an hour so they could observe me. My wife turned the screen away from her. Well send you a link to a feedback form. You're in and out and that was it. We scattered his ashes over a bunch of snowdrops. I had hope that the little bumps inside me were fighting just as much as I was to stay with me. But now that's changed. So that was it. This scan takes place between 18 weeks and 20 weeks 6 days of pregnancy and is commonly called the 20-week scan. I've still had no cramps or bleeding so fingers crossed everything is ok I just couldn't believe I fell down the stairs, I can't remember the last time I ever did that! It felt as if we had gone power crazy. Our baby was beautiful. I felt crushed, I wanted him to at least acknowledge what had been found already. Next most likely (but actually in the minority) they identify something which whilst not 100% healthy is treatable. As I lay down, and the sonographer started, I could see there was something wrong. There is more detailed information about the main conditions that are looked for during this scan on NHS.UK. Public Health England (PHE) created this information on behalf of the NHS. Emma was 20 weeks' pregnant when a routine scan revealed that the baby she was expecting had Down's syndrome and heart problems. Being deeply unhappy and kind to others at the same time is nigh on impossible. As I lay down, and the sonographer started, I could see there was something wrong. To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account. Then, three days later, I would go to the labour ward - the ward I had been expecting to visit in two and a half months. He was tiny, perfect and a Down's syndrome baby. These opinions do not represent the opinions of Tommys and are not advice from Tommy's. I remember thinking, 'Gosh' I now know it was a girl, I didn't know that then, that, 'She looks just like her brother'. Sam squeezed my hand and told me it was ok. Slightly marked from our peers. Again, no notes can have been written down because the midwife asked the same question. Although the anomaly scan is often called a 20-week scan, you may have it any time between 18 and 22 weeks, although it's usually done between 18 and 20 weeks. I noticed the box of tissues on the table. After the triple test you stop thinking, you stop thinking that anything can go wrong. He told me that they may want to do blood tests, but that 'he didn't see the point'. The hardest thing I have ever done. But I still didn't want to be the one who stopped this baby's chance to live. At which point they turned round and said, 'Well, there is something very seriously wrong with the baby, we don't know exactly what, but you do need to have a more in-depth scan at your regional hospital to find out the detail'. When he came back, he agreed on a termination. I was another one who did get bad news at the 20 week scan. We couldn't say we'd lost the baby, because he was still kicking away, but we couldn't pretend everything was fine, either. Others, including those who had been given leaflets to read about the scan beforehand as well as some who were health professionals, said that they had been nave about the 20-week scan. In this information, the word we refers to the NHS service that provides screening. And with each one we had to have the same conversations. Purpose of screening. Instinctively, did it feel right? So on the Monday we went in to see the senior sonographer, I think she was a consultant at the hospital. Smiling at myself and picturing me and Sam becoming parents. And I, and, I felt the weight of deciding what to do about it. . I know its hard- but i really wouldnt worry about it too much as the worry will stress you and your body out. And everybody knows and everything is right. Sometimes women were told that the sonographer had found a 'marker' or sign of a chromosomal condition and had to wait for an amniocentesis to confirm the findings. Where we were living then at the time you only had a scan at 20 weeks. or sort of light chat that we'd, we'd experienced before with previous scans. We left for home feeling completely numb. So we had to go in and out a couple of times, and we were just waiting around for ages and ages. I think there might be a problem'. By my own hand, I had to end the pregnancy. There was cause for concern. After half an hour of lying on the bed, I was starting to get nervous, but was excited to find out that the baby would be a boy and that I could see his little heart beating strongly. Severe chromosomal conditions such as Edwards' syndrome are now often picked up in the first trimester antenatal screening but itwill usually be more obviousat the 18- 20 week scan, though usually a firm diagnosis will not be made until one or two specialists have weighed up all available evidence about the baby - which usually means that another expert needs to scan the baby again, or until the woman has had an amniocentesis. The sonographer told me to take the notes, and the scan photos with me so they could review them also. It was over. I've realised that being a nice person is a luxury some can't afford. Many people were deeply affected by their experiences of the 20-week and subsequent specialist scans. The doctor or midwife looking after you will let you know before you come. Eventually, the doctor finished the scan and said that some of the baby's measurements were very small. After she had taken all the measurements, the sonographer told us that she was concerned with the length of the baby's limbs in relation to the head. I think at that time she had come to terms better with the fact that this baby was going to be terminated, and I don't think I was quite there. The sonographer then passes a hand-held probe over your skin to examine the babys body. You've had, you've had your Down's Syndrome check and that's okay. No discussion, no quiet contemplation. So even if anomolies are found, they don't always mean a problem.. x. I had issues at the 20 weeks scan with both of mine. And this baby sort of floated, and occasionally there was a slight movement, but it was very you could almost see that he was really poorly just from looking at the screen. . I was experiencing some light bleeding for the past few days. So had to come back in a week's time for a scan, which again is quite a common thing I found out. I broke down and started hitting my disgusting body that had done this. The chances that anything bad will be discovered are v v small. Unfortunately I was not met with a compassionate sonographer. Nice people shouldn't hear about what we'd done. Do you have any thoughts about that? And still we asked to see a, Impact of the 20-week and later specialist scans. For instance a couple who knew their baby was 'on the small size' were told he was fine at the 18-20 week scan, but discovered at 32 weeks that he had microcephaly. I had no issues at my 20wk scan with DD - and neither did any of my antenatal group (9 mums). Entering the labour ward, I waited for someone to say, "Go home, you are 16 weeks too early." This short video explains screening for 11 physical conditions in pregnancy. Could you tell? So we left it there, and we didn't actually think that there was anything really to worry about after that scan. 2022. Mumsnet carries some affiliate marketing links, so if you buy something through our posts, we may get a small share of the sale (more details here). The milk came and stayed for what seemed like for ever. 1. There are no known risks to your baby or the mother from having an ultrasound scan but it is important that you consider carefully whether or not to have the 20-week scan. For instance a couple who knew their baby was 'on the small size' were told he was fine at the 18-20 week scan, but discovered at 32 weeks that he had microcephaly. I didn't have a clue. I just feel very unlucky. For example, some babies have a condition called open spina bifida, which affects the spinal cord. I didn't really know what that was. I was then told yet again bad news. They said the brain was okay -, We were in there for a matter of minutes, literally -, In and out. I want to be happy again. Possibly with hindsight we could have been more worried about it, but was probably a good thing we weren't, because we weren't worried about anything basically. News stories, speeches, letters and notices, Reports, analysis and official statistics, Data, Freedom of Information releases and corporate reports. I wrote a few things down last night when we were trying to go over things, just to remind myself. Not a good sign in a hospital consulting room. As you felt that, you know, it was probably going to show lots of problems and it just wasn't what we wanted, but at the same time we needed to sort of see it and, we needed to prove it I suppose. Try to relax and take it easy. Seeing your baby on a screen can be really exciting. I hated my body and hated every feeling I was having. I think I don't everything just seems a real blur because it was, it was such a strange experience. But he was wrong. At first, I still had to deal with the physical implications of having given birth. The 18 -20 week fetal anomaly scan is a watershed in most pregnancies because for the majority of women it will be the last time they are scanned before giving birth. We were denying him his life. It was a bit worrying but on the plus side I got an extra couple of scans and an extra couple of pictures. The consultant showed us the letter with our result on and, yes, there were the words "Down's syndrome". It was just a few little things like the kidneys were hard to find, and the stomach was hard to find, but that might be because it wasn't filled with fluid. This publication is licensed under the terms of the Open Government Licence v3.0 except where otherwise stated. I went away and came back, and she couldn't get a good picture. You get extra care and monitoring as appropriate and baby is proactively treated. There was a very marked lack of amniotic fluid which made it difficult, not even for the scanners to see, that made the picture of the scan look very, very different. It was exactly like the labour I had with my first child. No, we really didn't, with hindsight we probably should have, but not at all, it never occurred to us to be worried about it. That he was small. Desperately trying to hold onto the glimmer of hope we'd been given. Several women had taken young children with them to the 20-week scan because they expected to see 'nice pictures of the baby'. The consultant at the time wasn't really that interested in that imagery. See more information about the 20-week ultrasound scan. Picture every packed football staduim up and down the country - all healthy pregnancies and births. Cardiac surgery can do some amazing things. And that, that was when things where it started going a bit wrong.